Interested in becoming a sleep consultant? 

Jayne Havens is a certified sleep consultant and the founder of Snooze Fest by Jayne Havens and Center for Pediatric Sleep Management. As a leader in the industry, Jayne advocates for healthy sleep hygiene for children of all ages. Jayne launched her comprehensive sleep consultant certification course so she could train and mentor others to work in this emerging industry.

Meet Jayne Havens

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 Sleep Consultant?

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Connection Based Marketing Strategies with Doula Darcy

Connection Based Marketing Strategies with Doula Darcy

The Doula Darcy is a certified postpartum doula and lactation counselor who has helped hundreds of new moms navigate the first twelve weeks at home with a baby since 2010. In addition to supporting new parents, Darcy also coaches doulas and sleep consultants to grow their businesses using connection-based marketing strategies.

On this episode we discuss:

– Best practices for marketing your business
– The importance of community in entrepreneurship
– The value of integrating virtual support into your doula business
– Why adding “Certified Sleep Consultant” is a great idea for doulas

Links: 

Take Your Postpartum Doula Business Virtual class

Coupon code: JAYNE20 to save 20%

Darcy’s Free Decision Making Checklist

Join our Facebook group to learn more about Becoming a Certified Sleep Consultant.

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Transcript:

Jayne Havens: The doula Darcy is a certified postpartum doula and lactation counselor who has helped hundreds of new moms navigate the first 12 weeks at home with babies since 2010. In addition to supporting new parents, Darcy also coaches doulas and sleep consultants to grow their businesses using connection-based marketing strategies. Darcy and I are very much aligned as this is exactly what we teach inside of CPSM. Darcy, welcome to the show. I’m so excited to have you here today.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Thank you so much for having me, Jayne, I love any chance I get to chat with you. So this is going to be fun. 

Jayne Havens: So when I was preparing for this interview, I was thinking back to when we first met, and honestly, I can’t even remember why or how we connected but I do remember that right from the start I felt really connected to you, as you were really doing for doulas exactly what I was doing for sleep consultants. And in so many ways we’re just so aligned. How did you decide to branch out from supporting parents postpartum to supporting other doulas that were trying to get their businesses off the ground?

Doula Darcy Sauers: Great questions. So I was a postpartum doula for about 10 years and loved it, loved every minute of it. I loved helping parents, and I love snuggling babies. I did that for about 10 years. I remember so vividly standing in one mom’s living room, answering her questions. And it just kind of hit me that like, these are the same questions I’ve been answering for the past 10 years. Every new parent has this. I mean, it varies somewhat. But we all have the same questions when we first have a baby, especially when it’s our first. And I just had this bout of frustration. Like I know there are so many other people probably even in this neighborhood at this very moment who need to hear these answers from a nonjudgmental professional, from a doula. So I was a little frustrated at only being able to help one mom at a time, really. And so I started to play around with like, well, maybe I could create a course for moms and so that I can help more moms. And then it hit me that before I was a doula. I worked in advertising and marketing for 10 years in New York, and New England. And that experience was extremely helpful to me as I started my doula business, and I thought, wait a minute, I can help even more families if I help doulas, with marketing so that they can help more families. So that’s really where the idea came from. And here I am.

Jayne Havens Yes, I love that. And so you took your sort of previous work experience and applied it to what you were doing, which made you an even better doula. And then a doula coach, I guess. Right? 

Doula Darcy Sauers: Well, I think and this is so common in the doula world, we finish our training and we’re so excited about being a doula that it’s not until we’re finished with our training and certification that we realized like, wait a minute, there are no real jobs to go apply for. It hits you like, I have to find my own clients. So I was lost at first, but then I was like, Wait a minute. I know how to do this. I’ve been helping small businesses do this for the past 10 years. So as a doula I was able to replace my corporate income quicker than most doulas do and build a sustainable and fruitful business. rather quickly and just in my years talking to other doulas and seeing other doulas `I started to really realize that this you know, and I always say it’s kind of a left-brain, right-brain thing that doulas are typically very empathetic and caring and feel like they’re born to be a doula. They have that right brain, artsy personality. They don’t have that left-brain marketing business mentality. So What I was, whether I was born with it or learned it along the way, I had both. And there are plenty of families having babies. It’s just marketing to connect the two. It’s not anything else. And I see doulas blaming themselves that they’re not trained enough. They’re not good enough. They’re not smart enough, they’re not experienced enough. And that is all not true. It’s just that these parents haven’t ever heard of you. They don’t know that and the way to fix that is marketing. 

Jayne Havens: Yes, and this is exactly why I wanted to have you on the podcast because I know that what you really do is you, coach doulas. Some of them now sleep consultants because some of the ladies that are in your program have also gone through mine. But you’re primarily coaching doulas to sort of grow their businesses through their marketing efforts. But what I love so much about you is that you and I are doing very much the same thing, right? We’re teaching our students how to make those connections so that they can actually bridge the gap, right? Bridging your skills and your knowledge with your customer, your client, it’s really, it’s really brilliant. I love that.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Well, that’s what marketing is like, your client is here at point A, you want to get them to point B and that’s hiring you. So the bridge from them to get from point A to point B is but they have to know you exist, that’s marketing.

Jayne Havens: Yes. So what are some of the things that you are? Can you give us some sort of insider tips? Like, how, how should a doula or a sleep consultant? What are best practices for marketing your business, for connecting with those clients? Yes.

Doula Darcy Sauers: So I’m glad that you’re asking this because I say marketing and I see people cringe, like, they think that means like, sleazy, used car salesman tactics, and paying lots of money for ads and that’s advertising. You know, paying for ads is advertising and marketing is just making the market aware of your business. And that is why we connected so well. Because my biggest tip is that networking is the most important thing that you can do. And it’s free. And that is how you and I met you and I can’t remember which one of us initiated it. But we just kind of found each other in Facebook groups and sent an email, like, let’s have a zoom, let’s meet, and well, I was just saying to my husband, like, I consider you now like one of my best friends. And I’ve never met you in person. But I mean, we’ve been doing these zooms for years!

Jayne Havens: And we’ve been supporting each other’s businesses. Like, you refer business to me, I refer business to you. So yes, we met on the internet to connect and network and be friends in air quotes or in real life. But we’re also like business partners, and associate friend connections, right? Like we’re supporting one another’s business. And I think that’s so important to actually get out there and meet people that you’re aligned with. So that you can refer business back and forth in a way that’s genuine, right? Like, I know that when I’m sending somebody to you to your program, I know that they’re going to be well taken care of. And I know that when you send somebody to me that they’re going to be well taken care of. And that’s why we feel confident, to send business back and forth because we know that our client or whoever it is that we’re referring to is in good hands with the other.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Right and that’s that’s a big piece of it. You want to network with people with whom you align with their values so that you feel good recommending them and they feel good recommending you and the other thing is so yes, we’ve become friends. And we’ve formed this great business partnership, but not for one second at any point did it ever feel sleazy or gross or forced or anything like that. It has been so easy. And I think that’s what I have loved about my entire doula career is that when I heard the words, postpartum doula, I was like, that was what I was born to do. I have to do that. It was my absolute passion. And my favorite quote about marketing is from Michael Hyatt and he says marketing is really just about sharing your passion. And so when you think of networking and reaching out to the people in your community, in a way that you’re sharing your passion and I always say as doulas or sleep consultants or nd doulas and sleep consultants we all have the same passion. We all want to help families. So reaching out networking with other birth professionals and sleep consultants never feel sleazy or forced or it’s you’re reaching out to someone who has the same interests that you do. So it’s easy. And that is so to answer your question, that is the biggest and first marketing tip that I give to everybody is to get to know the doulas if you’re going to be a local doula, the doulas in your area, if you’re working virtually get to know the big kind of the players online. Because when you’re working with clients, you can only work with a certain number at a time. 

Jayne Havens: Well for doulas that are working in person, but for sleep consultants, we work with more, but to your point, I do think that it’s still really important to network with, with industry professionals, because just to like take that analogy and, and make it relevant for sleep consultants I can think of certain sleep consultants with it, who have taken my course that have an expertise that is really unique and special. Whether it’s one of my graduates who work with older children, that’s her jam, like 5, 6, and 7-year-olds, one of the ladies who took my program really focuses on supporting parents that have children with special needs. So even if you are a sleep consultant, and you can support multiple families at a time, it’s still, I think, really important to network with other sleep consultants. Because you never know when somebody might not feel comfortable supporting a certain family for one reason or another, it feels outside of their scope, it feels outside of their comfort zone, it feels challenging, for whatever reason, I actually just decided recently that I’m going to try and wind down with supporting families on the west coast because it just feels hard for me, I don’t like to stay up late at night, I like to go to bed at like 9:30. So my clients on the west coast are putting their kids to bed at 730 or eight o’clock at night. That means I’m up until 11:00 or 11:30 or 11:45 during the first night of bedtime. And that just isn’t bringing me joy anymore. So I used to be fine with it. And now I’m not. It’s just not working for me anymore. And look, there is a silver lining, because I’m also awake at three o’clock in the morning, their time when it’s six o’clock in the morning, my time. So there are pros and cons. But I like to make sure that I have people on the west coast to refer to because I don’t like to do that type of work as much anymore. It’s just not making me as happy. So just to make the analogy relevant. I think it still is really relevant to network and connect with other sleep consultants, even though we can support more than one family at a time. Right?

Doula Darcy Sauers: Absolutely. I think the other thing is having a talk a lot about having an abundant mindset. You know, there’s plenty of people out there that need help getting their kids to sleep. So there’s no lack of potential clients for sleep consultants. There’s no lack of potential babies being born that their parents want to hire doulas. So, you need to come at your business with that mindset instead of thinking like, I’m just going to I’m not going to connect with any other consulting consultants or doulas I’m gonna competing with all of them it just it doesn’t work that way you’re better off getting to know them so like you said they we all have “dream clients” we like to work with like whether it’s the east coast west coast thing or for postpartum doulas some only like daytime work or some only like overnight work or like I always I love my favorite, favorite clients of all time to work with are the ones who’ve had C-sections that weren’t really wanting a C-section I just love that piece of postpartum doula work. So the doulas in my area that love the natural home births send those C-section clients my way and vice versa so I’m not to say you won’t work with someone that doesn’t align with that but it’s just to your point…

Jayne Havens: Yes this is another I knew I love doing business with you. I don’t know if you know but I had two C-sections one an emergency and one scheduled and you would have been a perfect doula for me. So that just proves my point even more. Yes. Let’s go back to the community piece for a second. I know you have a program called the Doula Village. Can you give us sort of a brief rundown of what goes on inside of that Doula Village? And why is it so important to have a community when you’re trying to grow a business? I know we touched on referral sources, and that’s great. But what else comes from a community?

Doula Darcy Sauers: Well, the evidence shows, and doulas love evidence-based research, but the Kellogg School of Business did a study and it was written up in the Harvard Business Review about the secret to success for female entrepreneurs versus male entrepreneurs. And I forget what the key to success was for the males. But the key to success for female entrepreneurs was that they had an inner circle of close female contacts who are also entrepreneurs. So I know maybe doulas and sleep consultants don’t think of themselves as entrepreneurs. But you are. So the secret to success and I believe this 100% is having and Jayne I consider you part of like my inner circle. It is so much better and easier to have a doula business or a sleep consultant business if you have an inner circle of close contacts who are cheering you on, brainstorming ideas with you, commiserating when something doesn’t work. And so in the doula village, we know, not only are we sharing, I’m teaching about marketing, but everybody’s sharing what works for them what they’ve tried, what didn’t work, but it’s also like, I had this really tough birth, or what do you guys do when a client cancels or ghost Do you know, all the situations that come up just as part of this work, but then a lot of support around the marketing piece of it as well. And then the doula village is also all about it’s we’ve got a library of training, it’s very similar to your program. And you and I always say, well, we do that too, in my group.

Jayne Havens: So yes, it’s like we created these programs completely separately from one another. And then whenever Darcy shares anything about her doula Village, I’m like, we do that inside of CPSM. Or anytime I share something about CPSM, she’s like, yes we do that in the doula village. So yes I think we’re sort of operating parallel universes. And, and I think that’s awesome that you have the evidence to prove what I know to be true and what you knew to be true. I do think that we women are stronger together. And our knowledge that we bring collectively is always more than what we have individually. And from a mindset space. I think we are able to be more positive when you have, as you said, a community of cheerleaders, even when things get hard, right, not everything is rosy in business building. We have ups, we have downs, right? We have clients that ghost us, we have all sorts of things that happen to us. But when you have a community of people that understand what you are up against, what you’re going through, and your day-to-day, I think it makes it easier to carry on when you’re by yourself in your own little silo. I think entrepreneurship can feel very lonely if you don’t have people.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Yes. And I compare it all the time to having a baby. It’s the same as you having this baby think, oh, this is gonna be great. You start a business and you’re like, this will be great, but then it’s like you do it and then you have a bazillion questions. And so hiring a doula or hiring a sleep consultant as your child starts to not sleep like the value in that is unbelievable to just have someone be like, okay, this happened. What should I do? This is what’s coming up next. What have you seen that works well? So just having somewhere you can go with those little questions as you know, build and grow your doula business or your sleep consulting business is so valuable and just makes it easier, it makes it better. So I always say, after you have a baby, you need that group of mom friends that also has a baby similar in age, so that’s what my Doula villages and that’s what CPSM is like.

Jayne Havens: It’s your mom friends!

Doula Darcy Sauers: Right. It’s those mom friends that you’re like, hey, this just happened to me. Has this ever happened to you? I can’t talk to my other friends about this, but I can ask this question in this group. 

Jayne Havens: Sometimes I pretend that my work friends are right here with me. One of my colleagues lives on the west coast. And I texted her over the weekend and was like, hey, you want to bring your kids over to play? Like, she lives across the country. And but like, that’s our banter, and it just makes me feel less alone to have somebody like her. And I pretend that she lives in Baltimore here with me, and she doesn’t. But I think that sort of camaraderie makes you feel like, okay, I’m not doing this completely alone. 

Doula Darcy Sauers: Yes. And it just again, makes it better. It makes you better as a doula or sleep consultant. So I just think it’s so important.

Jayne Havens: Yes. So let’s shift gears a bit and chat about virtual support. People are always asking me if I supported clients virtually before the pandemic, like they think that it’s a pandemic thing that I do all virtual sleep support. But obviously, not obviously, but my business model was virtual from the beginning. I think, on the other hand, you were in person, you’re working as a doula and then during the pandemic, you shifted? I’m not sure. Did you shift all of your business to virtual during the pandemic at first? Or were you still supporting families in person? And I guess I’d love to hear how you were able to make this shift. How were you able to articulate to your clients that your support virtually was still valuable?

Doula Darcy Sauers: Yes. So I did switch to virtual postpartum doula support because of COVID. In March of that year, when the world just completely shut down for two weeks to flatten the curve, I was like, well, I guess I’m taking two weeks off, and if I can’t go to these mom’s homes, as a postpartum doula, there’s nothing I can do. And I was like, okay, my business is successful enough, I can handle two weeks of no income, but then we all know that two weeks stretched into whatever. So after two weeks, I was like, this is kind of hairy. So honestly, what I really thought I was like, there’s no value. You know, at the time, I was like,c-section mom trying to recover from surgery, my biggest thing with all three of my kids was sleep. And this is another reason I love you so much. I mean, sleep was my passion. So I just think as a postpartum doula, All I do is show up and take care of the baby so that the parents can sleep. So if I can’t do that, like, there’s no value to my services. But in March of 2020, I had three or four families that I was working with and it was contracted with. And then we had to abruptly stop, but they had already paid me and I was like, I can’t continue to not earn money and refund them. So I thought, What could I do? So a few of them were having breastfeeding problems. So I was like, well, let’s just do a zoom. And I can just answer your questions. And the first two or three zooms that I did, the moms and dads loved it. Where, first of all, it was so great to talk to someone other than each other. I always say new parents have always been isolated. But COVID just brought that to a whole new level. And as we were doing the zooms, I was like, that’s right. There are questions about newborn care and bathing and feeding and all the things and then just talking through the feelings, listening to their birth story. It made me really kind of validate in my head the true value of what a postpartum doula offers. Yes, it’s great that they can go get a nap. But there’s so much more to the work that we do. And you can do that all virtually. So I kind of, by mistake, started offering these virtual services. And then because my business had been around for 10 years, I started to get more inquiries or my friends were asking, like, what are you doing for new moms? So I was like, we’re doing it virtually. And so…

Jayne Havens: It was working, it was working, as your families needed support, and they were getting it even if it looked different than what they were used to or what they were expecting. And it looked different than what you were used to doing. Right. It was still effective.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Exactly. They loved it. They came back for more and booked more sessions so It really made me see that there was incredible value in it. So I’ve kept on doing it. And one thing you and I talked about like it made me realize like wait a minute, I can actually serve even more clients if I’m doing a few zooms and some texting whatever it may be. I just have a million ideas which I put all into a class on how to take your postpartum doula business virtual here. I always say you’re only limited by your imagination and what kind of virtual packages you want to create to fit your life. So I would realize I was able to take more vacations and travel more because I wasn’t tied down to having to go to somebody’s home, I could be at my parent’s lake house and still make phone calls and texts. And I could I would, the couple of times I was messaging you and I’m like, I just got a new client and I’m on a boat.

Jayne Havens: And I was sitting at my in-law’s lake house, but also on a boat.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Right. And so when I used to, to take a week off, it was like, I had to stop taking clients for a month because I never wanted to say to a new family, like, when your baby’s three weeks old, I’m going to leave you high and dry. So, vacations used to be so hard, I have vacationed more in the pandemic than ever before, because I can still continue to serve my clients so I could take more clients. Anyway, it’s just been fantastic. And the doulas that work with me who have little kids, like you, can be a virtual postpartum doula and sleep consultants with your kids in the background. And I just think it’s so cool, how many doors it opens and the offer, you know what you can offer? So anyone listening can take that course and go to my website, douladarcy.com. And use the coupon code, JAYNE20

Jayne Havens: Oh, good. I didn’t even know we were gonna have a coupon.

Doula Darcy Sauers: I know, I just think he’s into me. So we’ll do JAYNE20. And you can save 20%. So that gets you the class for 77 bucks, and awesome. It’s all about pricing, packaging, and promoting virtual postpartum doula services.

Jayne Havens: I love that you’re teaching this because at this point, a majority of the women that take my sleep consultant certification program, I think a majority are postpartum professionals, doulas, and newborn care specialists. And they are all so used to being so hands-on, that they have a hard time wrapping their heads around what it looks like to support families virtually. And we teach that inside of CPSM. But it’s also helpful to have that reinforced from somebody that’s actually also doing it as a doula the way that you are. Because it’s really, I think, a mindset issue. I think that those that are so used to being so hands-on have a hard time using other tools to be effective like, if you’re a baby whisperer, because you’re an amazing swaddler. Like, I think there’s value perhaps, dare I say even more value in teaching a parent to swaddle their own baby just as well as you swaddled their baby. Right? So that’s super important. And that’s what I think is really brilliant about virtual sleep consulting, is that the parents really do have to do the work right. I can’t, I’m not coming in to swoop in and do this work for you. It’s hard work. And I am going to provide you with accountability and support and a solid plan, but it’s up to the parent to actually do the work. And I think that the results are better that way because we’re teaching parents to be the best parents that they can be.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Yes, I am so glad that you said that. Because I have found that to like, at first. I’m trying to think of an example. But it was a fun challenge for me as an experienced postpartum doula to be like, alright, if I was at their house, I would just take the baby and get the baby to stop giving jiggle. Right. So now I’m like waiting and okay, how do I describe to these two parents what to do? And so it was kind of fun. But then exactly as you said, I realized, like, I’m teaching them the skills and I would do that before, but oftentimes, a lot of times, the parents would hand the baby over, go take a three-hour nap, and then come out and be like, gosh, this, she sleeps so well when you’re here. So having to be on Zoom and teach, like you said, teach them how to swaddle, teach them how to hold even when you have a two-day-old, it’s like not so floppy, right? Like, take your right hand and put it here, but also I would joke with dads and partners like okay, Dad, you’re gonna be my Doula boots on the ground. Like, can you go get Mom a glass of water while she and I talked about this, or do you guys have snacks? and what for dinner tonight? 

Jayne Havens: You were like a virtual logistics team.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Yes. Which I used to just go there and do. Now it was more like, Ok, let me just teach you how you know, what the steps are of the day, and how you two can support each other. So I think it really does make them better parents and makes me a better doula. Because obviously, our education is the cornerstone of what we do. But it made me realize like sometimes, I really do just take over and make it easier for them and provide them a service. But here with virtual support, it really does. I’ve had so many doulas that I could talk all day, but like that I bought dolls, and started the setup, like these demonstration areas in their offices for teaching, swaddling, or bathing, and all that kind of stuff. And it truly is amazing. I’m also a lactation counselor, and I can’t even believe it, I thought, that I can’t do breastfeeding help on a zoom. But I’ve had a dad holding the phone up here, and over the baby, while they latch and just again, cueing mom, like what I used to do like propping her pillow up with my own hands, I’d be like, No, take the pillow, put it here. I think that one of my biggest success stories of the pandemic was helping a couple of babies get latched, without even being in the room like it was. So to anybody who’s frustrated or thinking that it’s not possible, I would encourage you to really think again.

Jayne Havens: Yes, and I think, it just goes back to really empowering our clients or the parents, and I think that’s really like the biggest victory of it all is when you support a family, virtually, you are giving them the tools to be successful on their own, which I think I mean, when it comes to sleep, I know it’s relevant in your work, too. But when it comes to sleep, it’s so important because this stuff persists, and like it, you know, babies, every time they learn something new, they try it out in their cribs and that, right? Like that can get hairy. If parents don’t know how to manage that stuff on their own, that can be tricky. We want them to actually learn how to write how to get in there and support their child when their child is going through something.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Exactly.

Jayne Havens: You are always saying to me, or not necessarily to me, but I hear you say it everywhere. Like it’s one of the things that you say is that doulas shouldn’t take a million trainings or they don’t need to take another training in order to grow their business or to find clients. But I also know that you feel a little bit differently when it comes to becoming a sleep consultant. Why is that? Why do you make the exception for doulas to take an extra certification to become certified sleep consultants

Doula Darcy Sauers: I talk about a lot is that, and I touched on this earlier, the idea that you’re not getting clients because you don’t have enough training and you don’t have enough offerings and you’re not good enough, you’re not experienced enough when the real true issue is just that nobody knows you exist. So if nobody knows you exist, and nobody can find your website or you’re not posting on social media. If you go get training to learn babywearing or belly binding or something that is not going to help you get clients. I am all for taking all the training in the world if you want to learn them, I say this all the time. So are people calling you and interviewing you? And then saying no, we’re going to hire another doula that knows how to belly bind? Or are you just not getting those interviews? Console requests, and most doulas are like, that I’m not getting the console. Another thing you can get on my website, is I have a whole worksheet to figure out, do you really need another training? Or do you need to focus on marketing? And part of that is like an income scenario like yes, becoming a lactation counselor, I think is great, because it’s another skill, you can raise your rates and you can charge and do extra, you know, other visits. Sleep consulting, I think, is the gold standard in terms of another training that you can take and take with you, Jayne. I mean, as you said, so many of my Doula coaching clients have gone through your program every single one of them raves about it. I bet because well, because it’s a great program, but also because I don’t see why you guys aren’t all millionaires.

Jayne Havens: I’m working on it.

Doula Darcy Sauers: I’m the most frugal person in the world when my babies were babies. I didn’t spend money on anything, but I would have given you all my money in my bank account if you had gotten me more sleep. So I think people are willing to spend money on sleep. I think it’s one of the biggest foundations of good health if sleep just makes everything better. It’s such a good thing to be doing. So anyway, sleep consulting ticks, all my boxes of it’s a skill that clients are going to pay for. It’s a skill that can earn you extra money. You could be a postpartum doula over here and a sleep consultant over here and be earning money and the way you teach it with you, you could be an in-person postpartum doula offering virtual sleep consultant services. You can just, it’s sort of like income on top of income exactly for not any more time or not a lot more time. So I just think it’s a no-brainer. I encourage it for lots of other reasons. A huge reason is as doulas, you know, we’re at their birth, or we’re, you know, in their homes, those first 12 weeks, like we are a very trusted source by the time that baby is three months old. And then we’re like, ok, it’s time for us to move along. Then one month later, I mean, we’re their first call when their baby starts going through that four-month sleep regression, or they’re six months, and they’re rolling over in the crib. So if instead of you saying, here’s a website and here’s another sleep consultant, I know if you could say, oh, let’s book a consult, and here’s my package that I offer. As a doula that’s a great way to continue to serve the clients that you have, we work so hard to get those clients and then I joke, like, you have to sit around waiting for them, and two more years for the hat for them to buy from having another baby. Yes, another baby. But if you can help them with their sleep concerns in between, that’s a great service to provide a great income stream for you. 

Jayne Havens: Yes, I love that. Well, thank you for your support. And I love it that you are always cheering on my business. And just like sleep support in general, I know that when it comes to people who are supporting parents, postpartum sleep is a heavy topic, right? Like some people are all about sleep some people are not. So I appreciate your support. And I hope you know that I am cheering you on every step of the way. In the same way, remind me what is that code? Before we wrap up, let’s share that offer of yours again, and then let everybody know where they can find you. If they want more information on any of your programs.

Doula Darcy Sauers: My website is douladarcy.com. And then I love hanging out on Instagram and Facebook. I’m The Doula Darcy everywhere. So please find me and follow me. I’m always talking about marketing tips and growing your doula business. Shoot me a message if you have questions. I also have a free Facebook group called the doula marketing group. Go ahead and join that. It’s a really great positive group where we’re focusing on all things marketing for your doula business. 

Jayne Havens: Thank you so much, as always, for chatting with me today. And we’ll have to do this again soon.

Doula Darcy Sauers: Yes, thank you, Jayne. I just love connecting with you. And like I said, I love, referring people to you. So I appreciate that you refer people back to me as well. So thanks for having me.

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